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HomeExclusiveWhat Nails For Joist Hangers

What Nails For Joist Hangers

Can Screws Be Used With Joist Hangers

DIY Shed AsktheBuilder Joist Hanger Nails and Screws

When properly installed, joist hangers can keep your floors and decks secure and in good condition. While structural nails are typically used to fasten joist hangers, you may be wondering if screws can be used instead.

You can use screws explicitly made for joist hangers. However, avoid using any other types of screws as they cannot support joist loads and are not designed to withstand shear force.

While screws made specifically for joist hanger support are an option, there are other types of attachments used. Well take a look at some of the other options and discuss why some work well while others dont.

Before we get into the details of connectors, lets take a look at what joist hangers are to begin with and what specific purpose they serve.

What are Joist Hangers and what are they used for?

Joist hangers are used as structural support for wood joists on floors, ceilings, decks, and other such applications. They are typically U-shaped and come in various sizes and shapes.

Joist hangers are designed so that they wrap around three sides of a joist and have multiple holes so they can be attached with fasteners to a beam or other structural supporting element. The most common material used for joist hangers is galvanized metal.

Because joist hangers are galvanized, the ideal types of fasteners are galvanized metal to avoid corrosion. Nails work well as long as they are sized correctly, but manufacturer-specified specialty screws can also work.

Roofing Nails

Specialty Nails

Framing Nails: What Nail Should You Use When Installing A Hanger

Framing nails used in wood framed construction are available in many sizes with different names that refer to a specific diameter and length. In addition, many framing nails are designed to be used with nail guns for quick installation, while others are more commonly driven in place with a hammer. So which nail should you use when fastening a beam or joist hanger? Does it matter? The answer is yes!

Manufacturers of connection hardware, such as Simpson Strong-tie, always indicate what type of nails should be used with their products. They typcially specify 16d, 10d or 8d common nails for the installation of hangers, straps and ties. On occasion they will specify a 16d sinker nail or 10d x 1 1/2 Teco nail. So why is this important? All of the hardware used in wood framed construction is tested and safe allowable loads are determined and published. Structural engineers and designers will then specify hardware for connections based on these allowable loads and expect the hardware to perform as advertised.

Our approach has been a compromise. There are many instances where hangers have extra capacity and smaller nails can be used. We include Lumber and Hardware Notes or Hanger Schedules on our drawings, indicating the type of nails that should be used with the hangers we specify. We try and specify 16d sinker nails , 8d framing nails and 10d Teco nails whenever possible.

Standard Common, Box and Sinker nail sizes

Can I Use Screws Instead Of Nails For Joist Hangers

While structural nails are typically used to fasten joist hangers, you may be wondering if screws can be used instead. You can use screws explicitly made for joist hangers. However, avoid using any other types of screws as they cannot support joist loads and are not designed to withstand shear force.

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Should You Nail Or Screw Joist Hangers

You can do either. According to Simpson, using their structural screws designed to work specifically with their joist hangers will result in a stronger connection than using standard nails.

Load tables show that the allowable load for a floor when using the screws is somewhere around 30 pounds higher than it is with nails, per connector.

On the other hand, while 30 pounds might not seem insignificant, it also wont likely cause your deck to collapse if you opt to use nails anyway its just not a massive difference.

Therefore, you are perfectly fine to use nails with joist hangers. Since youve spent the money to use joist hangers, there is no reason to spend more on the specialized screws unless you are planning on hosting large amounts of heavy people on your deck regularly.

While joist hangers are a cost, the specialized Simpson SD screws are an even greater cost. Youll need both the 1 ½ screws and the 3 screws. Depending on the size of your deck, youll need several boxes of each, totaling upwards of $200 or more, just for fasteners. Or you could simply buy a couple of boxes of nails for $20 and still be up to code.

What Size Is A 10d Common Nail

How to Install Joist Hangers

For years, the building code defined a 10d common nail as 0.148 inches in diameter and 3 inches long, and that definition occurred in one location in the code. In the shear panel table of the code, Figure 1, International Building Code , the minimum penetration was listed for each of the nail specifications.

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Main Differences Between Joist Hangers Vs End Nailing

The Main Differences Between Joist Hangers vs End Nailing are:

  • Joist hangers are metal parts that attach a joist to a ledger board, whereas end nailing is a technique of driving nails through a joist and a ledger board
  • Joist hangers are approved by most building inspections, whereas End nailing is not an approved joist connection technique
  • Joist hangers create strong connections, whereas the end nailing connections are not considered safe
  • Joist hangers utilize metal brackets to keep two beams together, whereas End nailing involves driving a nail or a screw through the face-grain of the joist piece
  • Joist Hangers create permanent connections, whereas the end nailing connections are only temporary

Install Hangers Rightthe First Time: Toenail Joists To The Ledger

Toenail decking joists into position along the wall ledger using a galvanized 16d nail. Make sure the top of the joist is even with the top of the flashing on the wall ledger so that decking will go on evenly. For outdoor work, use hot-dipped galvanized nails for indoors, use common nails. Start your nail before setting the joist in position, then hammer it in.

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How Many Screws Are In A Joist Hanger

joist hangersjoist hangerjoisthangershangershangerjoist

. Similarly one may ask, can you use screws on joist hangers?

Outdoors use 16d double-dipped galvanized nails for installing hangers. The manufacturers agree: Never use galvanized deck screws or drywall screws to install joist hangers. Those screws don’t have the shank size and toughness to support joist loads.

Likewise, how much load can a joist hanger take? Because you want a deck that can hold at least 55 pounds-per square inch, you multiply seven by 55, showing you that you’ll need a joist hanger that can support 385 pounds. Upon inspecting various joist hangers, you’ll notice information stamped on the side of the hanger and on the bottom this is crucial.

In this manner, how many nails are in a joist hanger?

Joist Hanger SplitDo not nail within 20mm of the ends of the timber beams. For each hanger, drive 16 nails into the supporting beam and 16 nails into the supported beam. Description: For timber beam to beam joints.

Is a joist hanger stronger than nailing?

According to McEntee, A joist hanger or hurricane tie connector will provide a stronger and more reliable connection than toe-nails.

What Nails Do I Use For Joist Hangers

Joist Hangers… are you using the correct nails? (Deck Expansion Part 4)

For interior framing, that means using only the thicker 10d, 12d or 16d common nails to fasten a joist hanger’s face flange to wall ledgers, headers and beams. Outdoors use 16d double-dipped galvanized nails for installing hangers.

Also to know is, is a joist hanger stronger than nailing?

According to McEntee, A joist hanger or hurricane tie connector will provide a stronger and more reliable connection than toe-nails.

Also Know, should you use screws or nails for joist hangers? Outdoors use 16d double-dipped galvanized nails for installing hangers. The manufacturers agree: Never use galvanized deck screws or drywall screws to install joist hangers. Those screws don’t have the shank size and toughness to support joist loads.

Likewise, people ask, can you use a nail gun for joist hangers?

Metal fastener gun: Several maufacturers make guns just for joist hangers and brackets. They have a guide point tip to align the gun with the hole and then you can shoot the joist hanger nail into it. 2.) Palm nailer: inexpensive choice.

How much weight can a 2×8 joist hanger hold?

Because you want a deck that can hold at least 55 pounds-per square inch, you multiply seven by 55, showing you that you’ll need a joist hanger that can support 385 pounds.

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Easiest Deck Joist Hanger Fasteners To Install

This is the single biggest reason to use screws. With an impact driver in hand, screws drive in so much easier than nails, especially in tight spaces.

That little 1 ½ nails barely sticking past your fingers. One wrong move and your hammering the wrong nail, your fingernail! You set them lightly, as not to crush your fingers and then they fall to the ground before you can drive them in. Yes, screws are so much easier to install in joist hangers.

1/4 inch hex-driver3/8 inch hex-driver

The Simpson Connectors with their 3/8 hex drive are the easiest to install. The drivers tight fit holding the screw head preciously in place, allowing movement without dropping out of the drive.

For the angle fasteners connecting the joist to the ledger, screws are even better, both in ease of installation and for their superior withdrawal strength

How Long Are 10d Nails

For years, the building code defined a 10d common nail as 0.148 inches in diameter and 3 inches long, and that definition occurred in one location in the code. In the shear panel table of the code, Figure 1, International Building Code , the minimum penetration was listed for each of the nail specifications.

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Nail To The Joiststandard Hanger

For standard joist hangers, secure the hanger to the joist using only 1-1/2 in. long galvanized joist hanger nails. Avoid longer nails that would poke through the joist and splay out the other side of the hanger.

When I worked construction, I would have lively discussions with carpenters who stubbornly held onto myths about proper joist hanger installation. Avoid installation mistakes by following the techniques shown in Photos 1 – 5:

  • Install the largest hanger that fits the lumber. Never use a 2×6 hanger on 2×10 joist hangers. Avoid disaster by spending a couple of bucks more for the correct joist hanger.
  • Fill all the holes in each joist hanger with the properly designated size nail. After you’ve hung 12 hangers on a wall ledger and your arm has turned to rubber, avoid the temptation to save your body by leaving some nail holes in each hanger unfilled.
  • Don’t reuse joist hangers, and don’t modify them by cutting them shorter or bending their outside flanges . Installing reused or modified joist hangers reduce their load capacity. Nailing into end grain will lessen the nail’s holding power by one-third.

Nails do matter. Using 3-1/2 in. long 16d nails to secure a hanger to a wall ledger gives you added strength. The long nails bite into the framing members behind the ledger for maximum holding power.

The Best Alternatives To Joist Hangers And End Nailing

Sheradised Joist Hanger Nail 1.25kg

End nailing isnt really a joist connection method since you can only use it to temporarily fasten a joist to a ledger board during the construction process. Consequently, joist hangers are the most reliable option if you want to ensure that joists are firmly attached to ledger boards.

Some carpenters use a toe-nailing technique as an alternative to joist hangers because it is more affordable.

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What To Do When This Defect Is Found

The reason for my update on this blog post is that the largest manufacturer of joist hangers, Simpson Strong-Tie, has put out a letter giving direction on how to correct this particular defect. In short, the fix is to remove the short nails going into the joist and install Simpsons #9×2½ SD Connector screws.

Click the following link to see the full document: Repair of LUS Joist Hangers Installed with 10dx1-½ Nails. This document also lists the newly calculated load capacities, which I cant imagine myself ever using as a home inspector. I leave that stuff up to the engineers.

Is this defect a big deal? No, probably not but as you can see, the repair isnt a big deal either. For an average deck, the repair will probably take a $20 box of screws and about an hour of someones time.

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Griprite 8d Galvanized Steel Common Nails

These GripRite 8D Galvanized Steel Common Nails are great for any kind of construction, including carpentry. They have a large shank which gives greater strength and resistance against bending, and theyre galvanized, which means they work well for outdoor use which is what you want if youre building decking.

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Is It Better To Use Nails Or Screws For Framing Decks

Nails are better in nearly all cases, particularly when installing joists. A regular 3 ½ deck screw has very little sheer strength. Shear strength refers to a screws ability to hold lumber, or other material, together against the force of gravity.

In other words, the screw is perpendicular to the ground, preventing the lumber from falling to the earth. This is opposed to using a screw to hold something down, in which the screw is parallel to the earth and the two members are not working against gravity.

The only time you should use screws when fastening joists is when using specialized joist hanger screws to fasten the hanger to the joist and the ledger board. In no other instance should you use screws to fasten joists on your deck.

If you are not using joist hangers, then you should only be using nails to toe-nail your joist to your ledger board and rim joist.

What Screws To Use For Decking Joists

How To Install Joist Hangers

Most are 8-gauge and, while 2 1/2 inches is the minimum length needed to hold boards to the joists, 3-inch screws are commonly used to provide extra holding power against the upward pressure of shrinking or warping boards. Specialty materials have different requirements.

Is a joist hanger stronger than nailing?

According to McEntee, A joist hanger or hurricane tie connector will provide a stronger and more reliable connection than toe-nails.

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Can You Use Roofing Nails For Joist Hangers

hangernailyou can usejoist hangerjoist hanger nailsnailscanjoist hangersusenailsroofing nails

. Also question is, what nails do I use for joist hangers?

For interior framing, that means using only the thicker 10d, 12d or 16d common nails to fasten a joist hangers face flange to wall ledgers, headers and beams. Outdoors use 16d double-dipped galvanized nails for installing hangers.

Similarly, is a joist hanger stronger than nailing? According to McEntee, A joist hanger or hurricane tie connector will provide a stronger and more reliable connection than toe-nails.

Also Know, can you use a nail gun for joist hangers?

Metal fastener gun: Several maufacturers make guns just for joist hangers and brackets. They have a guide point tip to align the gun with the hole and then you can shoot the joist hanger nail into it. 2.) Palm nailer: inexpensive choice.

Do I need joist hangers?

You dont need joist hangers if youre not attaching to a structure and hanging joists off a ledger or if you dont have a flush beam. Deck screws have very little shear strength they should NEVER be used to connect joists in any way shape or form.

55 pounds385 pounds

Bostitch Joist Hanger Gun

The other day I wrote about how much joist hangers have improved the construction industry. However, anyone that has used these hangers can attest to the slow nailing process of using the special joist hanger nails. Because joist hangers typically are attached to a single ply of 1 1/2 material the nails need to be shorter. In order to get the required shear tension strength the nails are typically specified to be a galvanized 1 1/2 nail with a certain diameter based on the hanger load. The problem is usually youre nailing these into some type of engineered lumber and your arm wants to fall off after the first few hangers.

Hence what this post is about. I finally broke down and bought this nail gun for the guys at work. Let me tell you something..I have a feeling none of my guys or myself will EVER hand nail joist hangers again. These metal connector nail guns are amazing. The guns are slightly different than most traditional nail guns in the way the nails sit prior to firing the gun. The nail actually sticks out of the end of the gun far enough so you can place the nail in the hanger hole prior to firing it. Basically you put the gun up to the hole, feel that its inside the hole then fire away. These guns even sink the nail fully into microlams, paralams and other engineered lumber products.

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What Is End Nailing

This is the most basic nailing technique, which is also the weakest. First of all, the end grain of the wood is the weakest, and you should never use this technique when building something you want to stay together.

End nailing is done by hammering a nail or two into the end of a post to attach it to the beam or decking. This type of attachment is typically only done as a temporary hold until it can be strengthened. In other words, you just do not use it in any type of permanent construction.

Other types of nailing, such as toenailing and bond nailing, are sturdier but still not as safe as using joist hangers. When building a deck, wall, flooring, or anything else that has to do with a home or something people will be using, there are laws in place that you have to follow. Most building projects have to include joist hangers to be up to code.

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